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	<title>MoreThanMine &#187; Big Things</title>
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	<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog</link>
	<description>An understanding that my life is a means for more ends than my own.</description>
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		<title>A dear friend warned me of this.</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/249</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/249#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 03:22:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Faith Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nateberends.com/blog/?p=249</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Last week, I asked Deb how I might try to pray for a situation whose desired outcome is unclear. On one hand, I might pray for something to happen. On the other hand, of course, I might also have cause to pray for the same thing to not happen. And sometimes, it's just not clear which way to pray.
]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A dear friend warned me of this.</p>
<p>She told me that as soon as I was done with college, I would find myself with a surplus of time and a degree of freedom that was before unthinkable.  With this time, she shared, I might find myself reading more books, finding more adventures, and sitting alone with more of my thoughts.  She&#8217;s said that she learned more in the three months since she graduated college than she ever did taking classes.</p>
<p>In the three days and six hours since I graduated college, I have begun my journey down a similar road.</p>
<p>What follows might be considered the first really burdensome lesson upon which I have been dwelling.</p>
<p><span id="more-249"></span>Last week, I asked Deb how I might try to pray for a situation whose desired outcome is unclear.  On one hand, I might pray for something to happen.  On the other hand, of course, I might also have cause to pray for the same thing to <em>not</em> happen.  And sometimes, it&#8217;s just not clear which way to pray.</p>
<p>&#8220;So, do we just pray that God&#8217;s will be done?&#8221; I asked with a hint of confused desperation.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t exactly recall the words she chose in response to my inquiry.  What I do recall is her discouraging me from such a prayer.  She said something about it reducing God to a puppet-animator God.</p>
<p>&#8220;But isn&#8217;t that how Jesus taught us how to pray?&#8221;</p>
<p>I pondered this question in silence, sitting on the couch in her office.</p>
<p>A puppet-God?</p>
<p>Now, almost a week later, I am still preoccupied with the question of how we pray for (and about) the things toward which we harbor uncertainty.</p>
<p>In the past I have prayed for abundant clarity. <em>Dear God</em>, I might begin, <em>please make it abundantly clear what you would have me do here.</em></p>
<p><strong><em>Abundantly clear</em></strong>; that there be no room for doubt or uncertainty; that God show me with decisive certainty what I am to do; <em>that God do the work of discernment for me.</em></p>
<p><strong>What am I praying for when I ask God to make something abundantly clear?</strong></p>
<p>On one hand, as a former high school teacher of mine answered on my Facebook page, I am in this prayer asking for &#8220;Clarity and/or discernment. And/or for direction.&#8221;</p>
<p>And that&#8217;s completely true.</p>
<p>But I&#8217;m also asking for something more.  I&#8217;m asking that God do the work for me.</p>
<p>Aren&#8217;t I?</p>
<p>I could, of course, do what our forefathers and foremothers have done through the ages&#8211;pray and fast and wait on the Lord&#8217;s voice.  I could wait and wait and wait for that point at which I might begin to discern God&#8217;s will for me.</p>
<p>Or I could pray that God make the next steps abundantly clear.  This sure would save a lot of work, wouldn&#8217;t it?</p>
<p><strong>What am I praying for when I ask God to make something abundantly clear?</strong></p>
<p>I&#8217;m praying that God give me a pass; that I not need to perform any legitimate effort of discernment on my own.</p>
<p>My sense is that to pray for abundant clarity might reduce God to the puppet figure that Deb told me about on the couch.</p>
<p>Considering these points, how do we go about praying?  For what do we pray?  Why does a simple prayer for discernment seem so&#8230;  <em>inadequate</em>?</p>
<p>(Am I completely off base here?)</p>
<p>Sometimes questions arise that we have a hard time immediately dismissing.</p>
<p>My dear friend has told me before how there are certain unsettling questions that she literally feels.  There are issues with which she wrestles that affect her in a very real and physical way.  There are questions that build a home inside of us, refusing to leave until we have satisfactorily addressed them.</p>
<p>This is one of them.</p>
<p><strong>What am I praying for when I ask God to make something abundantly clear?</strong></p>
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		<title>Something Big.</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/207</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/207#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Feb 2009 09:41:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nateberends.com/blog/?p=207</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My sense, tonight, is that something big is about to happen.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My sense, tonight, is that something big is about to happen.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>Dear Bob,</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/199</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/199#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 01:41:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Faith Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nateberends.com/blog/?p=199</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[    +Why People End Up In Alaska Since the footings of our nation were laid, people&#8217;s pursuit of discovery has always led westward.  It seems, then, only logical to regard Alaska as a culminating point in that journey.   In my first weeks, I noticed that the introduction processes around here have an extra [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em></em></p>
<p><em></p>
<div class="wp-caption aligncenter" style="width: 430px">Excerpted from a longer letter: </dt>
</dl>
</div>
<p></em></p>
<p> </p>
<p style="text-align: center;"><strong>Alaska So Far:</strong></p>
<p style="text-align: center;"><strong></strong></p>
<p style="text-align: left;"><strong>+These Jobs Are Everywhere</strong></p>
<p style="text-align: left;">It came as a relief to me when, on my second day in Alaska, at my orientation seminar the presenter acknowledged that nobody comes up to Alaska for the job.  There are a thousand different reasons why folks head toward America&#8217;s last frontier, but these reasons have little to do with a 40hr/week work contract.  There is no job up here that is without its counterpart in the lower 48.  With this reality, I began to understand that there is something very special that draws people to this place.  </p>
<p>In the &#8220;outside&#8221;&#8212;an Alaskan term for the rest of the United States&#8212;there are hotels everywhere.  There are restaurants and retail operations throughout the nation at which we could have just as easily applied for employment.  There are scores of National Parks, too&#8212;most of them closer to folks&#8217; homes than Denali.  </p>
<p>Nevertheless, we have chosen Alaska.  And it wasn&#8217;t because of the Job.</p>
<p> </p>
<div class="mceTemp mceIEcenter">
<dl class="wp-caption aligncenter" style="width: 430px;">
<dt class="wp-caption-dt"><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/scenic/alaskalife/DSC_1223.jpg"><img class=" " title="Glacier Landing Flight" src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/scenic/alaskalife/normal_DSC_1223.jpg" alt="Mount McKinley Glacier Landing" width="420" height="279" /></a><p class="wp-caption-text">Mount McKinley Glacier Landing</p></div>
<p> </p>
<p> </p>
<p><strong></strong></p>
<p><strong>+Why People End Up In Alaska</strong></p>
<p>Since the footings of our nation were laid, people&#8217;s pursuit of discovery has always led westward.  It seems, then, only logical to regard Alaska as a culminating point in that journey.  </p>
<p>In my first weeks, I noticed that the introduction processes around here have an extra feature.  In addition to typical elements of introduction found most anywhere, a common question around these parts is <em>&#8220;Why Alaska?&#8221;  </em>After pondering silently to myself as to why people&#8217;s responses seemed so similar, I began to more fully understand why.  A co-worker suggested that the only people who end up in Alaska are those who are running from something, or running to something.  What this is, of course, is simply two ways of referring to the same fundamental act.</p>
<p>People end up in Alaska because they have tried life&#8212;in any number of ways&#8212;and been left wanting.  People end up in Alaska because they are searching for <strong><em>more</em></strong>. </p>
<p> </p>
<div class="wp-caption aligncenter" style="width: 430px"><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/scenic/alaskalife/DSC_1484.jpg"><img class=" " title="Sugarloaf Mountain" src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/scenic/alaskalife/normal_DSC_1484.jpg" alt="Sugarloaf Mountain" width="420" height="279" /></a><p class="wp-caption-text">Sugarloaf Mountain</p></div>
<p> </p>
<p> </p>
<p><strong></strong></p>
<p><strong>+Where Faith Meets Culture</strong></p>
<p>I entered this summer with some degree of reticence with regard to what I expected to be a thriving bar scene.  I arrived to just such a scene, and nearly immediately discovered the bar to be a place of meeting&#8212;a place of community.</p>
<p>I have a shirt (which I pilfered from the Office of Admission) that boldly proclaims Seattle Pacific University as a place where <strong><em>Faith Meets Culture</em>.  </strong>I wear this shirt less and less these days.</p>
<p><strong></strong></p>
<p>In Alaska, I have confirmed a long-held suspicion that a college campus is not the intersection of faith and culture in nearly the same and significant way that a tavern is.  It is with a pint of Porter that one may begin an honest inquiry into the reality of both Faith <em>and</em> Culture.  This is not something that happens in a classroom of like-minded undergraduates.</p>
<p>To talk of abstinence from the realities of society&#8212;of cigarettes and ales&#8212;is to say nothing of any intersection of belief and reality.  To talk of how, as Christians, we are to behave responsibly <em>within</em> this reality is to begin talking about how Seattle Pacific University might hope to actually engage a culture to change a world.</p>
<p>Where, then do we find the point at which <em>Faith Meets Culture</em>?  Somewhere between two pints and a dartboard it seems.  There are probably other places, too.</p>
<p> </p>
<div class="wp-caption aligncenter" style="width: 430px"><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/scenic/alaskalife/DSC_1404.jpg"><img class=" " title="Walking Along a Ridgeline" src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/scenic/alaskalife/normal_DSC_1404.jpg" alt="Walking Along a Ridgeline" width="420" height="279" /></a><p class="wp-caption-text">Walking Along a Ridgeline</p></div>
<p> </p>
<p> </p>
<p><strong></strong></p>
<p><strong>+Community of One?</strong></p>
<p>Nevertheless, it has been a challenge to live as a person &#8220;set apart.&#8221;  My nearest ministry team member lives 3 miles away.  Our third team member lives 53 miles away.  And while I have made very significant and meaningful connections with Christian co-workers, this summer has provided an extraordinary lesson in the reality that Christian life is hard without the support of Christian community.  Christian life is prone to failure without the support of Christian community.  I am certain that my empirical side will not soon forget this summer.</p>
<div class="wp-caption aligncenter" style="width: 430px"><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/scenic/alaskalife/DSC_1478.jpg"><img class=" " title="Alpenglow" src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/scenic/alaskalife/normal_DSC_1478.jpg" alt="Alpenglow" width="420" height="279" /></a><p class="wp-caption-text">Alpenglow</p></div>
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		<title>The Logistics of Being Angry at God</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/198</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/198#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Jun 2008 22:11:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Faith Things]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Letters]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/198</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have, lately, been trying to figure out the logistics of being angry at God.
I read an article in a Cleveland, Ohio newspaper about Patrick's death, and in the comments section, people kept talking about how his family's deep and abiding faith would carry them through. Frankly speaking, that sounds like some bullshit that somebody would only say if they hadn't ever lost a son, a brother, a close friend. Like my friend Carissa, I'm not okay with dismissing this as a matter of God's will.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;It very much connects to my recent pondering on Joy.</p>
<p>This is something that I am sure I have shared with you before, but I must reiterate it in hopes that these thoughts continue to be meaningful. Much like your thoughts about beauty, I have been captivated by the reality that Joy might be one of the only things in the world that cannot in any way be purchased&#8211;only received.</p>
<p>I am sure that I told you about the end of my first summer as a counselor in 2005 at SpringHill when I spent some time trying to ponder the &#8220;big picture&#8221; of the summer. There I was, ten weeks older and well more than ten weeks wiser, and I was asking the &#8220;so what?&#8221; question. After a good bit of pondering, I arrived at <strong><em>patience</em><em> </em><span style="font-weight: normal">and </span><em>joy</em>.</strong></p>
<p>I would hate to seem too much of a reductionist, but there&#8217;s really nothing about life that is more complicated than those two things, working together&#8230; I think.</p>
<p>&#8230;and if you knew fully where I am coming from in writing this, you would begin to understand. I will try to explain this momentarily.</p>
<p><span id="more-198"></span></p>
<p>As Christians, (and this is only possible through what we may regard as &#8220;Christian hope&#8221;) we understand that there is something better. There is some purpose that goes beyond us. Perhaps most simply, I must, as a Christian, understand that life is bigger than me. My life is for something more. Yours is too.</p>
<p>We will always find joy in this greater purpose, and if we&#8217;re having a hard time with even that, we must be patient enough that we may wait until our eyes are opened to that joy. It&#8217;s about patience, and it&#8217;s about joy. But, you already know all of this.</p>
<p><strong>So&#8230; Where I am coming from&#8230;</strong><br />
Work here is terrible. I work with good people, and the work is enjoyable and challenging, but I am one of more than a thousand seasonal employees. I care not to elaborate, but work here is terrible. You&#8217;ll need to trust me here.</p>
<p><span style="font-weight: bold">BUT</span>. I live in Alaska. So it&#8217;s worth it. Again, you&#8217;ll need to trust me here. It is worth it 100%.</p>
<p>It has been much harder than I currently even realize to be so very far away from so many people with whom I am familiar. Alaska is good, but hard. I don&#8217;t think that there&#8217;s any bit of me that fully realized what it would be like to make life, if only for a summer, so far North into the unknown. At the end of the day, it&#8217;s a character building experience.</p>
<p>But really&#8230; The distance has been hard&#8230;</p>
<p>I received word yesterday that a guy who was on Chapel Core Staff with me this past year was killed, only 20 years old, in a bicycle accident. He was riding to work and a beer delivery truck didn&#8217;t see him&#8230; Or that&#8217;s how the story went by the time it got to Alaska. In any case, this was news that took me 4 days to hear. That was and continues to be hard.</p>
<p>In a completely unrelated story, there are two women, fellow seasonal employees like myself, who are presently lost, somewhere in Denali National Park. They were reported missing when they didn&#8217;t show up for work last week, and now, 5 days after they were reported missing, only 100 of Denali&#8217;s more than 9,400 square miles have been searched. The dense foliage and rugged terrain make the search very slow, if not sometimes nearly impossible.</p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t know either of these ladies, but their story affirms the reality that, in a moment&#8217;s time, life can change. They went out for an overnight backpacking trip, and their lives changed. My buddy Patrick got on his bike to go to work, and his life <em>ended</em>.</p>
<p>So&#8230; How do you deal with the reality of loss when there&#8217;s not a soul in sight who knows you for who you really are?</p>
<p>That&#8217;s the predicament at the present moment.</p>
<p>I have been very distracted, so my minute-to-minute life has not been terribly negative, but when I have opportunities, such as now, to reflect on such things, I begin to feel completely overwhelmed by the reality of loss.</p>
<p>I talked to the girl who led our Chapel Core Staff this last year, and she, very profoundly, admitted that she&#8217;s not ready to be okay with Patrick&#8217;s passing away. She&#8217;s not ready to say that she&#8217;s okay with his death. She&#8217;s not ready to say that she has found the silver lining in the situation, because, in reality, there may not be one. And I really admire her forthrightness about that.</p>
<p><strong>I have, lately, been trying to figure out the logistics of being angry at God.</strong><br />
I read an article in a Cleveland, Ohio newspaper about Patrick&#8217;s death, and in the comments section, people kept talking about how his family&#8217;s deep and abiding faith would carry them through. Frankly speaking, that sounds like some bullshit that somebody would only say if they hadn&#8217;t ever lost a son, a brother, a close friend. Like my friend Carissa, I&#8217;m not okay with dismissing this as a matter of God&#8217;s will.</p>
<p>What if this is a result of the fact that the world is being held captive to sin, pain, and destruction?</p>
<p>Certainly I will affirm that God is active in the world today, but until Christ comes again, so is Satan. Satan is alive and well in the world today, and because of that, I am not okay with any condolences that dismiss this issue as a matter of God&#8217;s perfect will.</p>
<p>And yet&#8230;</p>
<p>Scripture is full of passages in which God asks people, very plainly, &#8220;what right do you have to be angry?&#8221;</p>
<p>What right do I have? None.</p>
<p>But the world is a broken place, and I&#8217;m still trying to figure out how to cope.</p>
<p>What right do I have? None.</p>
<p>But that doesn&#8217;t mean that it doesn&#8217;t hurt.</p>
<p>&#8230;and it all comes back to patience and joy, doesn&#8217;t it? </p>
<p>It&#8217;s hard to be really joyful right now. But I have faith that if I am patient, I will soon find joy again.</p>
<p>And that&#8217;s a good feeling.</p>
<p>Please find the opportunity to read Job 38 (and 39?). God is God, and we are not. And while that does little to aid in coping with a broken world, at least it does something to affirm that God <em>might, just maybe, possibly </em>know that there&#8217;s a bigger plan in the works here. And at the end of the day, it&#8217;s not about you. It&#8217;s not about me. It&#8217;s about something bigger. </p>
<p>Life is bigger than us, and somehow that&#8217;s an idea that is a little comforting.</p>
<p>I am reminded of a Max Lucado quote:<br />
<em><strong>If it&#8217;s all about you, then it&#8217;s all up to you.</strong></em><em><strong>God loves you enough to say that it&#8217;s not about you.</strong></em></p>
<p>I will look forward to sharing more about Alaska, but now is maybe not a super time for that.</p>
<p>I am very pleased to hear that you are well.</p>
<p>Most fondly,<br />
Nate</p>
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		<title>124 Reasons to Ride Amtrak</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/186</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/186#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jan 2008 05:56:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/186</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[After just shy of 50 hours on a train, I have decided that maybe pictures will tell the story better than words.  (I&#8217;ll use a few words anyhow, I suppose.) ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After just shy of 50 hours on a train, I have decided that maybe pictures will tell the story better than words.  (I&#8217;ll use a few words anyhow, I suppose.) </p>
<p><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/thumbnails.php?album=14" target="_blank"><img src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/spu/amtrak_to_seattle/normal_Amtrak_Empire_Builder_%285_of_124%29.jpg" width="389" height="259" /></a><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/thumbnails.php?album=14" target="_blank"></a></p>
<p><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/thumbnails.php?album=14" target="_blank"><img src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/spu/amtrak_to_seattle/normal_Amtrak_Empire_Builder_%2810_of_124%29.jpg" width="389" height="259" /></p>
<p><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/thumbnails.php?album=14" target="_blank"><img src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/spu/amtrak_to_seattle/normal_Amtrak_Empire_Builder_%289_of_124%29.jpg" width="389" height="259" /></p>
<p><span id="more-186"></span></p>
<p><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/thumbnails.php?album=14" target="_blank"><img src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/spu/amtrak_to_seattle/normal_Amtrak_Empire_Builder_%2843_of_124%29.jpg" width="389" height="259" /></p>
<p><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/thumbnails.php?album=14" target="_blank"><img src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/spu/amtrak_to_seattle/normal_Amtrak_Empire_Builder_%2845_of_124%29.jpg" width="389" height="259" /></p>
<p><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/thumbnails.php?album=14" target="_blank"><img src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/spu/amtrak_to_seattle/normal_Amtrak_Empire_Builder_%2841_of_124%29.jpg" width="389" height="259" /></p>
<p><a href="http://photos.nateberends.com/thumbnails.php?album=14" target="_blank"><img src="http://photos.nateberends.com/albums/nates_albums/spu/amtrak_to_seattle/normal_Amtrak_Empire_Builder_%2825_of_124%29.jpg" width="389" height="259" /></p>
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		<title>Mark Driscoll v. The Emergent Movement</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/168</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/168#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Oct 2007 23:49:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Faith Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/168</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mark had written several articles for secular magazines and had been interviewed a few times on the radio and had gotten this reputation as a pastor who said cusswords. It is true that Mark said alot of cusswords. I don’t know why he did it. He hadn’t become a Christian until he was in college, [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>Mark had written several articles for secular magazines and had been interviewed a few times on the radio and had gotten this reputation as a pastor who said cusswords.  It is true that Mark said alot of cusswords.  I don’t know why he did it.  He hadn’t become a Christian until he was in college, so maybe he didn’t know he wasn’t supposed to say cusswords and be a pastor.  </em><br />
<strong><br />
(Donald Miller, Blue Like Jazz) </strong></p>
<p>I read this book and excerpt nearly two years ago and I unwittingly sat through an entire service of Mark, <em>The Cussing Pastor</em>, without making the connection.  Miller actually speaks quite well of Mark, and says that his church represented the first time in years that a church made him feel like he could breathe, but this wasn&#8217;t my experience.</p>
<p><span id="more-168"></span></p>
<p>I had indeed planned on elaborating upon my experience last Sunday, but in the course of research today, I stumbled upon an epic feud.  (Well&#8230; Epic in it&#8217;s implications, but hardly a fued as the conflict has failed to ilicit much response from those who Driscoll implicated.) In fact, <a href="http://theviewfrommarrs.wordpress.com/2007/09/23/mark-driscoll-at-convergence-we-were-all-witnesses/" target="_blank">Tony Marr</a> writes,</p>
<p><em>“There have been a few moments in church history that have defined or exposed a movement. I think that the 800 or so of us sitting in the chapel on the campus of SEBTS tonight were witness to such an event. &#8230; After Mark was done, John and I went to have a drink with a few of the guys from <a href="http://www.acts29network.org/" target="_blank">Acts 29</a>. There was this feeling in the air as if we had just been a part of something that will be talked about years from now.”</em></p>
<p>More or less, within about an hour and a half (you can download the podcast <a href="http://www.sebts.edu/chapel/podcast.cfm" target="_blank">here</a>) Mark Driscoll decried the emerging church movement and implicated three people in it.  Brian McLaren, Doug Pagitt, and Rob Bell.</p>
<p>The folks at <a href="http://emerginggrace.blogspot.com/2007/09/open-discussion-convergent-podcast.html" target="_blank">Emerging Grace</a> summarized the accusations pretty well, writing:</p>
<p>1.  Brian McLaren &#8211; Guilt by Reading and Footnoting</p>
<ul>
<li>Mark is very concerned with Brian&#8217;s influence from several authors.  He spent considerable time explaining the questionable doctrines of the authors that Brian has referenced &#8211; Borg, Crossan, Chalke, and Wilbur.  Based on Brian&#8217;s association with these authors, Mark implied that Brian&#8217;s belief in atonement is questionable.</li>
<li>The other concern that Mark has with Brian is his &#8220;increasingly obscure&#8221; stand concerning homosexuality based on quotes by Brian in Time Magazine and Christianity Today.</li>
</ul>
<p>2.  Doug Pagitt -</p>
<ul>
<li>In the &#8220;Listening to the Beliefs&#8221; book, Doug said, &#8220;we should reconsider the idea that there is a necessary distinction between creator and creation.&#8221;  Mark explained that, according to Romans 1, this is by definition paganism and idolatry.</li>
<li>Also when he asked Doug if homosexual practice is incompatible with the christian faith, Doug&#8217;s response was no.</li>
</ul>
<p>3.  Rob Bell -</p>
<ul>
<li>Strike One &#8211; Brian McClaren covers Rob&#8217;s pulpit when Rob is gone.</li>
<li>Strike Two &#8211; Rob uses rabbinical sources, and the rabbis didn&#8217;t know or love Jesus.</li>
<li>Strike Three &#8211; Trajectory hermeneutic.  Based on the &#8220;horrible&#8221; book &#8211; Slaves, Women, and Homosexuals &#8211; Mark says that Rob is guilty of theological evolution in arriving at the egalitarian position.</li>
<li>Strike Four &#8211; Because of Rob&#8217;s remark about the virgin birth in the book Velvet Elvis, Mark said that Rob&#8217;s theological method is frightening.</li>
</ul>
<p>Now, here&#8217;s where the problems begin.  First and foremost, there is the issue of who appointed Mark Driscoll as the arbiter or Orthodoxy and heretics?  If God <em>has</em> appointed him to such a task, there is very distinct advice in the book of Matthew 18:15-17 saying:</p>
<p><em><strong>15</strong> “If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. <strong>16</strong> But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. <strong>17</strong> If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. </em></p>
<p>Conservative interpretation of this text says that this is advice meant solely for disputes within the context of a church congregation.  In fact, in the new testament there is scipture of ten times that Paul doesn&#8217;t follow this protocol, and comes out and makes public his accusations against false teachers.  But there is something unsettling about the inflamatory nature in which Driscoll went about this matter.</p>
<p>Firstly, his accusations against Brian McLaren are more (<em>actually&#8230; completely</em>) based on the authors he cites and references than on his own personal theology.</p>
<p>Secondly, his claims against Doug Pagitt, they have basis in truth.  Doug and Mark have spoken to a great extent on this matter.  Props to Pagitt for his forthright answers when questioned.</p>
<p>Thirdly, Rob Bell gets the short end of the stick.  In fact, about 40 minutes into the podcast, Mark Driscoll says:</p>
<p><em>Thirdly, Rob Bell.  A man I&#8217;ve never met.  I don&#8217;t know if he&#8217;s nice or not.  I know he&#8217;s creative, I know he&#8217;s talented, I know he&#8217;s gifted.  Brian McLaren covers his pulpet.  Go to iTunes, it&#8217;s there.</em>   (Earlier in the talk Mark also makes a somewhat angry-ish comment about Rob Bell copying his idea to name a church Mars Hill, saying he&#8217;s <em>still in therapy trying to get over it.</em></p>
<p>Driscoll begins his argument against Rob Bell by his association with Brian McLaren who he has previously failed to legitimately implicate.  In fact the implication here is that Bell is guilty because he hangs out with McLaren who is guilty because he cites and quotes questionable people. (Didn&#8217;t Jesus get some negative attention for talking to people whose opinions were unpopular?) ((I&#8217;ll admit.  Maybe that&#8217;s a stretch.  But it&#8217;s worth thinking about.))</p>
<p>I digress&#8230;  Back to Rob Bell.</p>
<p>At most, as <a href="http://emergentvoyageurs.blog.com/" target="_blank">Jamie Arpin-Ricci</a> points out in his comment at <a href="http://emerginggrace.blogspot.com/2007/09/open-discussion-convergent-podcast.html" target="_blank">Emerging Grace</a>,  he&#8217;s guilty of some careless writing with regard to how he phrased that whole virgin birth stuff.  Mark particularly insults Rob with a claim of arrogance as it pertains to the preaching of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trajectory_Hermeneutics" target="_blank">trajectory hermeneutics</a>.  By-and-large, however, Mark&#8217;s criticism is overstated.</p>
<p><strong>So why is this important?</strong></p>
<p>The pastor who has a swearing problem is pulling the heresey card on his co-workers.  Is there some amount of discontinuity here?  Not to suggest that swearing is by any means a damnable sin&#8211;except by the reality that all sins are equal and carry no relative weight against one-another&#8211;but there is some degree to which a true man of God is to strive for Christlike behavior.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.precipicemagazine.com/christian_current_0907.html#the_driscoll_effect" target="_blank">Precipice Magazine</a> writes:</p>
<p><em>My concern, again, is with this idea that one can somehow be excused of all sorts of unChristlike behavior- merely because one’s church attendance is swelling. Again, the question should be- swelling around what conceptions? Isn’t the issue of what we are growing just as important, dare I say more important, than how fast we’re growing it? Apparently not. At least for some of the folk coming from this particular stream of the reformed spectrum.</em></p>
<p>For all of the people who are up in arms about this ordeal, we need to remember that we&#8217;re completely missing the point on this matter.  The goal is not to create division in the church, and to take sides is only to ignore Christ&#8217;s proclaimation that we are to Love one another as he has loved us.</p>
<p>I had sincerely hoped that my summary of this ordeal would be much more rounded, and I am not completely sure if I have succeded here. (I fear I have not.)  But I don&#8217;t think that this is about reaching a conclusion.  Rather it is about asking what has happened to us as a universal body of believers that has caused us to so completely miss the boat here.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure there&#8217;s more to come.</p>
<p><strong>ADDENDUM</strong></p>
<p>Attached below is a very good play-by-play if you&#8217;re interested in a summary of Driscoll&#8217;s talk without listening to the whole hour and a half.  <a href="http://jonathanbrink.com/" target="_blank">Jonathan Brink</a> posted this as a comment at <a href="http://emerginggrace.blogspot.com/2007/09/open-discussion-convergent-podcast.html" target="_blank">Emerging Grace</a>.</p>
<p><strong><a href="http://nateberends.com/content/audio/sbts_podcasts/Convergent%20Conference%20-%20Session%203.mp3" target="_blank">I have posted the audio here.</a></strong></p>
<p>Here are my thoughts through the audio.</p>
<p>1. I wouldn&#8217;t assume that Mark hasn&#8217;t had significant conversations with McLaren, and Pagitt or others people already. He intimates in the audio that he has at certain times, especially Pagitt.</p>
<p>2. He says 19:50 of the audio, When God speaks, we are not to converse, we are to obey. This saddens me because it assumes that everyone understands the Gospel with perfect clarity and we don&#8217;t. Jesus met with Nicodemus, as example. He gave the disciples three years of training. The very nature of discipleship and the journey is to seek and engage the questions and learn. Grace provides the framework for learning and failing so we can stay in learning. To not converse is to close dialog and learning.</p>
<p>3. Mark&#8217;s concern for McLaren&#8217;s relationship with Crosson and Borg (around 22:00) reminds me of the Pharisees concern about Jesus hanging out with sinners. He never calls out anything specific that McLaren likes about the book, just that he&#8217;s associating and referencing them. His reference to an earlier work in Time assumes they are saying the same thing and that McLaren is agreeing to it. McLaren never said that.</p>
<p>4. I&#8217;m not going to defend McLaren&#8217;s position on homosexuality. My responsibility is to love them, not change them. Sadly I don&#8217;t think McLaren has communicated this well. Mark does use the term hammer as a way of communicating truth, which is why I think he doesn&#8217;t get the emerging church.</p>
<p>5. Mark has mastered the pregnant pause well.</p>
<p>6. Again McLaren&#8217;s use of footnotes (30:00) appears to get him into trouble. But in the same respect, Mark&#8217;s concerns are with the book McLaren is referencing and he&#8217;s making assumptions about what Brian means by the footnote. I just read it and its just muggy. Mark is again drawing conclusion based upon a tiny footnote, not with the words of the author. Again, guilt by association.</p>
<p>7. Doug&#8217;s comments about sexuality are his.</p>
<p>8. At 37:25 Mark quotes Doug&#8217;s word in a book. He says, &#8220;the idea that there is a necessary distinction of matter from spirit or creator and creation is being reconsidered.&#8221; I don&#8217;t know if Doug is referring to the nature of what he hears happening in the world or what his personal beliefs are. Mark doesn&#8217;t provide the context, only the quote. (Help here).</p>
<p>9. Rob Bell &#8211; The McLaren comment (40:15) is flippant and I doubt he realizes what he said.</p>
<p>10. At 40:20 Mark says, (Rob) holds up rabbinical authority as the KEY to Bible interpretation and hermeneutics.&#8221; This is just an absurd comment and shows that he doesn&#8217;t know or listen to Rob. Rob looks at Scripture in light of rabbinical interpretation and context. But would he call it the KEY? Come on. Driscoll shows his weakness here. Rob absolutely holds Jesus as the key to hermeneutics. He doesn&#8217;t cite anything Rob says, mind you. He just references a common misinterpretation of Rob.</p>
<p>11. The trajectory stuff seems personal and esoteric. I&#8217;ve actually talked to the elders of Mars Hill personally about how this topic came out and they worked it out. It is clear he hasn&#8217;t.</p>
<p>12. (44:16) He actually insults Rob. Wow.</p>
<p>13. (44:35) Velvet Elvis and Virgin Birth conversation. Mark obviously missed the point of the chapter. Rob doesn&#8217;t draw the conclusion in the book that Mark draws. Lots of big words and misunderstadning. Again seems personal. (Earlier in the audio he expressed his frustration at Rob regarding the use of Mars Hil).</p>
<p>14. (49:50-52:45) Again, hanging with the sinners. Is it possible that Wilbur and all got some stuff right? I&#8217;ve actually read some of the people he references and he&#8217;s throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Sweeping generalizations here.</p>
<p>15. The New Reformed. All of his friends. Sounds like an interesting crowd.</p>
<p>16. He talks about the need for new forms. Loved it.</p>
<p>17. Look to Jesus. Love it.</p>
<p>18. (1:02:09) &#8220;The emerging crowd loves Jesus the man. Not Jesus the God man.&#8221; What is he smoking? Cites no reference here. Sweeping.</p>
<p>19. (1:06:50) Incarnational. Nice. I wish he had stuck with this. It was really good because what he doesn&#8217;t realize is that so many in the emerging church are saying this same thing.</p>
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		<title>Will You Be My Friend?</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/133</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/133#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Apr 2007 02:27:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.yourproductioncompany.com/nateberends/blog/archives/133</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have this problem, you see? I will walk into used bookstores, get excited about the treasures held therein, and buy as many of them as I can afford. I picked up this book to criticize the cover, opened it to read the title poem and, much to my surprise, ended the poem with teary [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have this problem, you see?  I will walk into used bookstores, get excited about the treasures held therein, and buy as many of them as I can afford.  I picked up this book to criticize the cover, opened it to read the title poem and, much to my surprise, ended the poem with teary eyes.  Here it is:  the title work in James Kavanaugh&#8217;s <em>&#8220;Will You Be My Friend?&#8221;</em></p>
<p><span id="more-133"></span><br />
<strong><br />
Who am I?  I am not sure.<br />
Once I was a rabbit&#8217;s grave and a basketball hoop on<br />
the garage, a cucumber patch, lilac trees and peonies crawling<br />
with ants.  I was stepping stones and a mysterious cistern,<br />
grass fires, water fights and ping pong in the basement.<br />
I was a picket fence, a bed and maple chest of drawers<br />
I shared with brothers, a dog named Sandy who danced.<br />
Friends were easy to find.  We climbed trees, built grass huts,<br />
chased snakes&#8211;and we dreamed a lot.</strong></p>
<p><strong>WILL YOU BE MY FRIEND?   Beyond childhood.</strong></p>
<p><strong> Who am I?  I am not sure.<br />
Once I was predictable.  I was educated, trained, loved&#8211;not<br />
as I was, but as I seemed to be.  My role was my safe<br />
way of hiding.  There was no reason to change.  I was approved.<br />
I pleased.  Then, almost suddenly, I changed.  Now I am less<br />
sure, more myself.  My role has almost disappeared.<br />
My roots are not in my church, my job, my city;<br />
even my world.  They are in me.  Friends are not so easy to find&#8211;<br />
and I dream a lot.</strong></p>
<p><strong> WILL YOU BE MY FRIEND?   Beyond Roles.</strong></p>
<p><strong> Who am I?  I am not sure.<br />
I am more alone than before.  Part animal, but not protected<br />
by his instincts or restricted by his vision.  I am<br />
part spirit as well, yet scarcely free, limited by taste and<br />
touch and time&#8211;yearning for all of life.  There is no security.<br />
Security is sameness and fear, the postponing of life.  Security<br />
is expectations and commitments and premature death.  I live<br />
with uncertainty.  There are mountains yet to climb, clouds<br />
to ride, stars to explore and friends to find.  I am all alone.<br />
There is only me&#8211;and I dream a lot.</strong></p>
<p><strong> WILL YOU BE MY FRIEND?   Beyond security.</strong></p>
<p><strong> Who am I?  I am not sure.<br />
I do not search in emptiness and need, but in increasing<br />
fullness and desire.  Emptiness seeks any voice to fill a void,<br />
any face to dispel darkness.  Emptiness brings crowds and shadows<br />
easy to replace.  Fullness brings a friend, unique, irreplaceable.<br />
I am not as empty as I was.  There are the wind and the<br />
ocean, books and music, strength and joys within, and the<br />
night.  Friendship is less a request than a celebration, less<br />
a ritual than a reality, less a need than a want.<br />
Friendship is you and me&#8211;and I dream a lot.</strong></p>
<p><strong>WILL YOU BE MY FRIEND?   Beyond need.</strong></p>
<p><strong> Who am I?  I am not sure.<br />
Who are you?  I want to know.<br />
We didn&#8217;t sell Kool-aid together or hitchhike to school.  We&#8217;re<br />
not from the same town, the same God, hardly the same<br />
world.  There is no role to play, no security to provide, no<br />
commitment to make.  I expect no answer save your presence,<br />
your eyes, your self.  Friendship is freedom, is flowing, is<br />
rare.  It does not need stimulation, it stimulates itself.  It trusts,<br />
understands, grows, explores, it smiles and weeps.  It does not<br />
exhaust or cling, expect or demand.  It is&#8211;and that is enough&#8211;<br />
and it dreams a lot.<br />
WILL YOU BE MY FRIEND?</strong></p>
<p><strong> James Kavanaugh<br />
Leucadia, California  1971</strong></p>
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		<title>Sure thing, dad.</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/120</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/120#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Oct 2004 04:46:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.yourproductioncompany.com/nateberends/blog/archives/120</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[All he asked was that I do it better than him.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All he asked was that I do it better than him.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
			<wfw:commentRss>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/120/feed</wfw:commentRss>
		<slash:comments>0</slash:comments>
		</item>
		<item>
		<title>Thanks, Dan Lynn.</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/117</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/117#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Oct 2004 05:09:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.yourproductioncompany.com/nateberends/blog/archives/117</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nate, I only hope that on some night in the future, I&#8217;ll be playing with a sound man half as good as you. Your future only holds bigger and brighter things, and we were downright lucky to have you while we did. -Dan]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Nate, I only hope that on some night in the future, I&#8217;ll be playing<br />
with a sound man half as good as you. Your future only holds<br />
bigger and brighter things, and we were downright lucky to have<br />
you while we did.</i></p>
<p>-Dan</p>
]]></content:encoded>
			<wfw:commentRss>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/117/feed</wfw:commentRss>
		<slash:comments>0</slash:comments>
		</item>
		<item>
		<title>If nobody believed in you.</title>
		<link>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/115</link>
		<comments>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/115#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Oct 2004 05:47:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael Berends</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Big Things]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Faith Things]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.yourproductioncompany.com/nateberends/blog/archives/115</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tell me, how would you feel? You&#8217;d probably give up too, If nobody believed in you.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Tell me, how would you feel?<br />
You&#8217;d probably give up too,<br />
If nobody believed in you.<br />
</i></p>
]]></content:encoded>
			<wfw:commentRss>http://www.nateberends.com/blog/archives/115/feed</wfw:commentRss>
		<slash:comments>0</slash:comments>
		</item>
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